That was very kindly done..:)

Really interesting analysis of the current issues in Israel

Very good policies on welfare reform.

It's always good seeing us strengthening our links with Labour parties throughout the world.

Very interesting to hear that we face similar challenges from an ageing population, to helping young people to find their feet in an ever changing society.

The Labour movement's strength comes from our universal values and its great too see that our Labour Party is retaining and strengthening its links with our partners in Israel

I am very concerned that the Israeli Minister was not questioned about Palestine and that this forum has ignored the plight of the Palestinians, in running this as a front page story.

It is accepted by most informed independent organisations (such as, for example, the UN Special Rapporteur on Palestine) that the treatment of Palestinians, by Israel, is deplorable. In fact, their daily lives are plighted by apartheid. It is the tradition of the left to protect the abused  - somthing that we seem to be failing at, in this instance.

Palestinian civilians are daily subjected to humilation and their very lives are treated as a disposable commodity. Homes are destroyed. Wealth is withdrawn. Freedom of movement impossible. I have written on this site before about the roads within the west bank closed to Palestinans (open to Israeli settlers) and the disparity in the cost of basic services (such as water - Palestinians being charged substantially more than settlers)

Propoganda about Israel is rife, and their lobbying power is strong. However, we should be looking to expose the truth (whether its something we are comfortable with, or not) as it is only with honesty that we can hope to achieve peace.

A very interesting peice and I am not surprised it sounds similar in policy. It is, after all, a Western State in all senses of the word and thus, is likely to adopt western, european style politics.

 Unfortunately we seem to have one of the usual "PALESTINE!" crowd in also, now. I will be more objective than usual about this, though I am sure some will accuse me of just being an evil Israeli supporting Tory without actually reading what I have to say...

I can understand from where you come, and such, but I have to disagree. The problem is not entirely that of Israel's, but of the arabic states and the Palestinians themselves and nothing will be done until all 3 bodies will admit to it [which Israel has always been ready to do, as well as several states such as Jordan, Lebannong and Egypt, all with strenous conditions]

In 1948 perfectly reasonable lines were drawn that would have allowed the co-existence of a Palestinian and Israeli state. However, in 1948 the Arabs and the Palestinians all took up arms against the newly formed state of Israel and the Jewish population over some areas of arable land in the south near the city of Elat up to around Mizpe Ramon where the population, at the time, was largely arabic and not jewish rather than settle this easily at the negotiating table and draw up either co-existence lines, or even a new border to split the area more equally, the states and the Palestinians declared war.

Needless to say, the Israeli's soundly walloped the four Arabic state armies and the Palestinian Militias by themselves.

This sets the ball on any kind of legitimacy of the Palestinian question from now on. Palestine lost and it has to suffer that loss as a continued point of contest.

By the six Day War in 1967 Palestine didn't exist on any kind of map at all. The Gaza Strip was annexed officially by Egypt and the West Bank was officially annexed by the Transjordan Kingdom.

In a bizarre twist of fate, the Israeli's actually put the enitre idea of a Palestinian state back onto the books by  invading these territories in 1967, but not formally annexing them as part of the Six Days War.

Since then it has been stuck between a rock and a hard place in regards to the Palestinian Question.

Sacrifices have been made to the Palestinians because of the method of Palestinian Militants and as ever it's rare for the British Media to actually report this, simply because of the restricted press within those areas, not by the Israeli government which has a free press corps, but by the Palestinian Authority.

Hamas etc build schools, hospitals and other civil buildings which are tall and then promptly use them as fire bases to launch quassam rockets into specifically Israeli civillian areas.

They have workshops specifically within civillian areas so that when the Israeli's legitimately respond with force against an attack, civillian casualties are maximised, thus continuing the cycle and increasing the hatred between the Palestinian masses, who are starved of information, ignorant of their own history and unable to do anything but listen to their own governing powers and thus, direct their hatred towards the "Zionist agressors" even though, more often than not, the Palestinians Infada's are just that. Palestinian in start and execution.

Another oddity which has always prevailed in the Palestinian Question are the Palestinian refugees within the surrounding Arabic States. It has been a full 60 years since the Palestinians arrived in Lebannon, Syria, Jordan and Egypt and they're still living in shanty towns and such and not allowed to actually try to merge with the rest of society of their new "host nation".

If these states truly beleived in the plight of the Palestinians, they'd have accepted their new "brothers" with welcome arms and slowly and steadily integrated them into their own society as immigrants, much as we have done so here?

Instead though, we see a laxadasical "victim" approach that tries to portray Israel as the font of all evil for the plight of the Palestinians, when the states themselves have done no better to alleviate the situation on what is, ultimately, a terrible result of the whole war.

Displacement. They instead perpertrate the myth that the Israelis are somehow all to blame, even though it was the Arabs who instigated the 1948 war that started the whole catastrophic chain of events.

Similarly, Israel is also to blame, during the intial 1948 war there were massacres and atrocities comitted by both sides, this has also continued today with the problem of the Palestinian areas tight and urbanized environs proving a problem to the IDF's heavier equipment, coupled with the problem of the enemy possibly being everywhere and nowhere leads the Israeli's to adopt a ruthlessly pratical approach.

The demolition of buildings that have been used as fire bases before, as well as the homes around it to deny the ground to the enemy literally. This causes the problem of further incitment from the Palestinians due to the obvious problem of demolishing homes with no replacements forthcoming.

In the Israeli mindset it would be like America giving Osama Bin Laden a new condo because they blew up his old one in Afghanistan. It's something that wouldn't even cross your mind to do.

I have another interesting aspect I'd go on about, but instead I shall give you a youtube link to an interesting documentary on some of the "massacres" of the Palestinians by the IDF. If you've never seen it before, you may wish to take a look.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=t_B1H-1opys

Obviously not all footage from Palestine is faked, I'm not suggesting anything of the sort, but it does make you think when you see an ambulance suddenly appear in a flash on camera during such "massacres".

That's all I can think of for now, I'm sure I've brought down a storm from somewhere... >_>

Yes I see you enter a country take the country and land by military you then arm that country with Nukes and tell the rest your stuffed, some way of working out a deal.

"A very interesting peice and I am not surprised it sounds similar in policy. It is, after all, a Western State in all senses of the word and thus, is likely to adopt western, european style politics." - Angry Voter

Western States aren't based on racist fantasies about 'chosen peoples' and 'promised lands'.

Nor do they have Israel's Nuremberg style race laws, like the one against Jewish/Arab mixed marriages.

By the way, isn't it funny how this wasn't mentioned in the chat about social affairs? I suppose it just never came up.